ASOT Tune Of The Year prediction

[Miss Glam]

make peace not war!!

 

[djabstraction]

what in the world is going on in this forum...i hope no one is upset

make peace not war!!

haha 100% ack!

Don't worry, it's just me stepping in, expression my opinions really badly, and offending everyone.

Just to add, if anyone is offended by what i've said, I apologuise and offer a hug, , just don't punch me in the face! lol!

 

[Tarek]

with 1870 people voting for that No 1 I have still hope fpr the globe...


no, it's the flavour of the young trance kids growing up right now (which is always the broadest base for influencing trends and opinion making) so producers make it and DJs have to support it.
Those kids will be sitting here in 5 years time criticising the same influences the uplifting peeps do right now.

I think I could be considered a "young trance kid" but I know what the difference between pop and trance is..

 

[90degrees]

you sure?


sorry if you took offense, glad that you are an exception.

this thread got kinda heated and I don't really understand why. And about what, a run down of tracks played by a DJ and voted for by his listeners?
So hard to have a civilised discussion?
Abstraction raised a couple of valid points, and though he used an unlucky term it's not name calling and I can see where he came from.
I see posts here in threads of seperatism and kinda propagating musical apartheid.
I understand that going down this lane and getting caught in those discussions is fairly easy as this station is so specialised. But tastes are different.
Music, no matter the genre, will always inter and cross breed, the fact that vocals are the flavour of the month -which is not really my taste- is tough but i will get over it. No need to get all excited over it, you can't prevent it anyways.

I do agree that mods should be moderating but not propagating.
Course they are entitled to their own opinion but not necessarily to voice it, representing not just themselves there is a responsibility, a reason for "moderation" and modesty, at least in choice of words.
And "Bucket" shouldn't be in that vocabulary...

 

[DreamensioN]

you sure?


sorry if you took offense, glad that you are an exception.

this thread got kinda heated and I don't really understand why. And about what, a run down of tracks played by a DJ and voted for by his listeners?
So hard to have a civilised discussion?
Abstraction raised a couple of valid points, and though he used an unlucky term it's not name calling and I can see where he came from.
I see posts here in threads of seperatism and kinda propagating musical apartheid.
I understand that going down this lane and getting caught in those discussions is fairly easy as this station is so specialised. But tastes are different.
Music, no matter the genre, will always inter and cross breed, the fact that vocals are the flavour of the month -which is not really my taste- is tough but i will get over it. No need to get all excited over it, you can't prevent it anyways.

I do agree that mods should be moderating but not propagating.
Course they are entitled to their own opinion but not necessarily to voice it, representing not just themselves there is a responsibility, a reason for "moderation" and modesty, at least in choice of words.
And "Bucket" shouldn't be in that vocabulary...

Well said 90degrees.

I whole heartedly agree with you that the moderators of AH.FM should be careful about what they say about particular DJ's. As moderators & staff members - WE represent AH.FM. So whatever we say, AH.FM says. And what you said is 100% correct. As staff members, we are entitled to our own opinions, but should choose carefully where and when to voice them.

This is especially important during such events as right now, when there is so much public attention on the forums.

 

[dan]

Well said 90degrees.

I whole heartedly agree with you that the moderators of AH.FM should be careful about what they say about particular DJ's. As moderators & staff members - WE represent AH.FM. So whatever we say, AH.FM says. And what you said is 100% correct. As staff members, we are entitled to our own opinions, but should choose carefully where and when to voice them.

This is especially important during such events as right now, when there is so much public attention on the forums.

I totally agree here, I read the thread 2 times and seen some of the things a AH Staffer should not be saying, so I quote you on

As staff members, we are entitled to our own opinions, but should choose carefully where and when to voice them.

I strongly suggest AH mods keeps this in mind while expressing their thought's in any future posts. Thank you

Also I will quote 90 which is a nice way of putting it.

I do agree that mods should be moderating but not propagating.
Course they are entitled to their own opinion but not necessarily to voice it, representing not just themselves there is a responsibility, a reason for "moderation" and modesty, at least in choice of words.
And "Bucket" shouldn't be in that vocabulary...

I can't speak for every individual mod on AH.FM, but I would like to apologize to anyone that was offended in anyway.

Lets enjoy EOYC

 

[Tarek]

you sure?

Well since you're asking...:grinning2:
Wiki says:

In opposition to music[B] [U]that requires [URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Music_education"]education[/URL] to appreciate[/U][/B], a defining characteristic of pop music is that anyone is able to enjoy it. Artistic concepts such as [URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Musical_form"]musical form[/URL] and [URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aesthetics_of_music"]aesthetics[/URL] are not always a concern in the writing of pop songs,[[I][URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citation_needed"]citation needed[/URL][/I]] [U][B]the primary objectives being audience enjoyment and commercial success.[/B][/U][URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pop_music#cite_note-0"][U][[/U]1][/URL] This of course does not imply that those goals are achieved by every song in this genre.[URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pop_music#cite_note-1"][2][/URL]

If we take the first underlining and put it in this context, I would assume the "educated" rank would be someone who knows how it is formed,mixed,edited, etc (ie: a producer, DJ or a "diehard" fan)

The second underlined phrase is essentially true. For example, if we take classical music, not many people understand it enough to appreciate it, because it is a complex genre.If you notice people who learn to play instruments and become good at it, in most cases they will learn to enjoy and appreciate the genre associated with the instrument

We can take trance and put it in the same category. You have to understand it, because it is complex, especially without vocals. If I took this genre and introduced it to some people, I'd be willing to bet alot would not like it because ie: it's too long, too boring, too repetitive, no vocals (in some cases), etc etc. Some people do not understand that genres such as trance and classical are much much more personal than your average Simple Plan rock band for example.

The root of this problem has been mentioned: People interpret trance differently, depending on how they react to it. Now if we apply this to what is happening in this thread, my conclusion would be

-Armin is NOT destroying trance. He is simply "adapting" it for those who cannot/do not want to appreciate the old styles (I am not belittling those people by the way), effectively creating a new genre : Pop-trance. Things like those mash ups of different rock band songs with trance is a clue of this. Increasingly vocalised trance is another clue.

The same way there will always be fans of classic rock, even if it's decreasingly popular because of the new ADAPTED rock, there will always be fans of "classic trance".

DJ Abstraction is completely right when he says in life there is change. But he is wrong when he says people "are hating on Armin"

People are not hating on him. They are exasperated because Armin has incredible talent with "classic trance" and yet he's moving on to "pop-trance" in order to please the most gullible crowd (ie: teenagers).

But that's just me:grinning2:

Oh yeah, and in regards to being offended..(although I don't understand why I should be..) I'm not..and won't be. I've been in enough heated discussions and debates of different kinds to know how it rolls. :grinning2:

 

[PhillipAlpha]

Kids - lets look at one big point here - T4E, DFX all fo you.

ASOT Top 20 is _NOT_ Armins Personal Top 20! - so stfu and dont act as if it is... heck not even i can make a top 20 - since some tunes are in fresh memory and some arent - and in the end you'd forget some...

ASOT Top 20 is voted for by the ASOT _LISTENERS_ - so if it looks like that - nothing that Armin, my mom, your mom or Dan or the naked guy outside my window can do about it - except whine a bit and then life moves on... you are saying the quality is dropping - i agree - but Armin is still playing and supporting uplifting - unlike most of you guys in here - he plays a varied blend of trance - which falls into peoples liking (myself included) - i heard your show yesterday dfx - and even tho i liked a few of the tunes - the set was for me - rather monotonous - but you dont hear me cry "DFX KILLS TRANCE" - now do you?...

so now girls - go brush your hair - get ready for School - and stop talking like you know stuff



My Point is - to improve quality - either DFX or T4E or any of the other people of their belief start producing "OMG TRANCE" or ASOT becomes bi-weekly

 

[Margoss]

ASOT Top 20 is _NOT_ Armins Personal Top 20! - so stfu and dont act as if it is...

that is of course true, but you have to wonder why the listeners pick those tunes to begin with... and then again, armin produces exactly this kind of stuff himself, plus plays it in his regular shows and on events... so i don't think there's that much of a difference.

and btw, after all the heat in this thread, i think "stfu" is completely the wrong expression...

so now girls - go brush your hair - get ready for School - and stop talking like you know stuff

so who knows stuff? you?

 

[Margoss]

i heard your show yesterday dfx - and even tho i liked a few of the tunes - the set was for me - rather monotonous

this argument i hear quite frequently, and i think this is amazingly well explained by tarek's great post just above:

We can take trance and put it in the same category. You have to understand it, because it is complex, especially without vocals. If I took this genre and introduced it to some people, I'd be willing to bet alot would not like it because ie: it's too long, too boring, too repetitive, no vocals (in some cases), etc etc. Some people do not understand that genres such as trance and classical are much much more personal than your average Simple Plan rock band for example.

it makes total sense that people who don't understand trance, who have no feel and no ear for it, find it monotonous and boring. i would quote the rest of tarek's post, because it is so true, but that would be too much. only one point i disagree with: moving to pop-trance as he calls it, does kill trance, in that it makes people believe that this is trance. "simplyfying" it in that way, removing the complexity, substituting it with "common" features (vocals) doesn't do trance any good - yes, more people will obviously like it, but it won't help them a bit appreaciate the real thing, quite the opposite.

 

[Margoss]

oh another thing, don't you hate multiple consecutive posts

but you dont hear me cry "DFX KILLS TRANCE" - now do you?...

of course you don't, because you can't possibly say that to someone actually playing trance

 

[Tarek]

moving to pop-trance as he calls it, does kill trance, in that it makes people believe that this is trance. "simplyfying" it in that way, removing the complexity, substituting it with "common" features (vocals) doesn't do trance any good - yes, more people will obviously like it, but it won't help them a bit appreaciate the real thing, quite the opposite.

That may be, but in the eyes of those who enjoy it and the DJ (well..lets hope not), it IS trance.

Classic rock lovers can easily say that the newer rock/metal bands kill classic rock. But classic rock lives on..because it is "classic", hence the name. People who enjoy old school rhyme-with-a-reason rap say that today's mainstream "rap" kills the old rap because all it talks about is girls and money, instead of fighting politics and rapping about real life.

We can put the scenario in every context...(hmm surprisingly not on classical though..) for every genre. Trance is no different, except that the "real" trance is being produced and supported much more than pop-trance..for the moment at least. Nobody did anything except complain about the new "killer" genres for every classic genre, and if it continues like this with trance, it will wind up in the same state as the others..

This is where Afterhours.fm comes in. When REAL trance (and don't argue that it isn't, you're just digging your own hole) is played,promoted,introduced, and spread out, it is the most effective way of fighting the new trend of trance. You have to show the big guys that you don't like what's going on.

Let's just hope it works..and if it doesn't..lets hope there will always be producers willing to produce the trance we all have to come to love. As long as people will want it, people will produce it.

PS: I'm not supporting this new trance. I don't hate it, because I know that some people enjoy it, so I respect that, but I don't enjoy it myself, and I'm not alone. In fact I wish the big DJs weren't so bent on the whole Top DJs list thing, because it is THAT kind of competition that sparks these strokes of desperation (ie: being a crowd's pet..not sure if that's the right term for it). If people just realized that if you just play what you like, you will always find your suited audience. For instance, DFX likes the psy-trance, and A-M likes it too. So A-M would most likely go for DFX instead of ..say T4E. I love uplifting trance, so I would go for T4E instead of DFX..get my meaning?

 

[PhillipAlpha]

i consider myself playing trance too? - and people say i do - and my listeners say i do - the crowds and the public view here has me as a trancehead - but still the defenders of the real Trance - doesent call what i play trance? - as stated elsewhere - try looking on the tracklist for armins yearmix - that looks nothing like the Top20..

 

[Margoss]

That may be, but in the eyes of those who enjoy it and the DJ (well..lets hope not), it IS trance.

that is exactly the problem. all the noob djs playing all the cheese, thinking they're trance djs now. plus all the people loving the cheese, thinking that they're tranceheads now. to me, this vocal stuff has nothing that makes trance what it is, i bet the cheese lovers will run fast and far if you try to make them listen to the real thing...

This is where Afterhours.fm comes in. When REAL trance (and don't argue that it isn't, you're just digging your own hole) is played,promoted,introduced, and spread out, it is the most effective way of fighting the new trend of trance. You have to show the big guys that you don't like what's going on.

and that is exactly what happened here in this thread people expressing their displeasure with this new trend. but apparently some people felt being peed on their foot by someone saying something bad about their "trance" god. kinda reminds me of apple - their fancrowd will always love whatever apple produces, and don't you dare say anything bad about it

PS: I'm not supporting this new trance. I don't hate it, because I know that some people enjoy it, so I respect that, but I don't enjoy it myself, and I'm not alone.

same here, with the exception that i hate it for the simple reason that it gives trance a bad name.

In fact I wish the big DJs weren't so bent on the whole Top DJs list thing, because it is THAT kind of competition that sparks these strokes of desperation (ie: being a crowd's pet..not sure if that's the right term for it). If people just realized that if you just play what you like, you will always find your suited audience.

QFT!

 

[Tarek]

i consider myself playing trance too? - and people say i do - and my listeners say i do - the crowds and the public view here has me as a trancehead - but still the defenders of the real Trance - doesent call what i play trance? - as stated elsewhere - try looking on the tracklist for armins yearmix - that looks nothing like the Top20..

I don't see anywhere in this thread a reference to you or your sets..but I see what you mean..

I think that the problem isn't what we think trance is, it's what the definition of it is. People forget that there are rules to producing trance. It's not because you have synth sounds or moaning female vocals that you have trance (which is what some DJs may think). The dictionary definition of it is not being respected. When that happens ,it would not/should not be called trance anymore, but simply pop.

There are thousands of pop songs that contain moaning female vocals and synth sounds and "bleep blop bip bloop" sounds, but it does not automatically make it trance.

 

[PhillipAlpha]

i'll just stop trying talking sense here

have fun

 

[Margoss]

I think that the problem isn't what we think trance is, it's what the definition of it is. People forget that there are rules to producing trance. It's not because you have synth sounds or moaning female vocals that you have trance (which is what some DJs may think). The dictionary definition of it is not being respected. When that happens ,it would not/should not be called trance anymore, but simply pop.

There are thousands of pop songs that contain moaning female vocals and synth sounds and "bleep blop bip bloop" sounds, but it does not automatically make it trance.

finally someone that gets my meaning \o/

thank you

 

[Altered-Mind]

here is a nice article via wikipedia explaining trance music

Trance music - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Tarek]

i'll just stop trying talking sense here

have fun

Yeah you know what..I'm done here too..

 

[haig]

unfortunately there's quite a lot of people around that think that the asot vocal crap IS uplifting trance...

hahahahaa